I Think I've Figured it out

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HSDrac011

Senior Member
So, after wondering why i dont like MO that much anymore, and why it seems alot of other people are getting fed up with it and refer to "Beta" as the highpoint of MO's life (highpoint referring to people actually having MASS mounts of fun [when they were able to login and not crash of course]) is because 1 simple thing: The Crafting system, I mean its GREAT that is so "in depth" and stuff, but the fucking time it takes to get ANYWHERE in the crafting system is to the point where people say "screw this i dont feel like spending money to play this god forsaken game for 2+months skilling up a crafter+ gathering enough resources to craft my shit just to have myself die and have to do it ALL over again when ALL I want to do is PvP in this self proclaimed 'PvP' game"

Difference between Now+Beta:

In Beta: you could go out, mine the ore, and immediately get medium end materials by refining just basic ore.

Now: you have to refine the basic ore, refine what u refined, refine that, refine the next thing, refine several other things to get the refined goods to refine yet again, then finally be able to have enough mats to make 1 item you want for combat

Conclusion: MO is a PVP game, its SUPPOSED to be a PvP not a "spend several months to finally be geared to PvP" game..... When people see the NUMBER 1 highlight of MO (which is PvP) they EXPECT to be able to hop in and PvP without having to go through the arduous task of what is the crafting system.

Also, dont tell me "well these people can always join a guild or have some1 else craft the gear for them and buy the gear" .... thats why people say fuck this game, because they come to this game expecting to be able to at LEAST be able to make their gear on 2 of the chars and then PvP on the 3rd, which you CAN do, just takes way to dam long of a time to get to the point where you can craft the gear.

Conclusion #2: Dial down the crafting/refining system to make it ALOT less of a pain in the ass so people dont just get bored and say screw it and quit.
 
It is not intended to be purely PvP and if that is what you think, I would say you have minsunderstood the direction. It's been about PvP for too long is the problem. The people who came expecting a sandbox and not a deathmatch have already come and gone in part due to the fact those elements were woefully implemented early on. Awkenening is a nice step toward making it less of a deathmatch arena, it's a step I hope that leads to more and more like it.

Simply put, if they took your advice they might as well shut down MO and make a game more like War of the roses in it's place and save themselves the aggravation.
 

oheyo

Junior Member
Its a purely pvp game to you,

but to a lot of us its not. Ideally the trade broker and market would pick up and all the systems will be interconnected and we'll all work with each other to get what we want. The systems will help support your play style no matter what you want to do. The trade broker was a very good step towards inter-reliance, but now it'll just take time to sort itself out, and maybe a few balances(aka: Dont drop over powered weapons on bandits).
 

Bernajo

Exalted Member
There are two games for you bud. War of the roses and chivalry. Both allow you to pvp all you like without crafting. Problem solved.
 

Landor

Well-Known Member
I kinda of agree with this. Currently it is just a pain in the butt to get mid tier resources like Steel or Bron. That is mostly because of the amount of resources in each rock nodes. I say either increase the amount of resources in each node or at least have it varied, specially since you have have these huge rocks that only have 1 or 2 nodes which are only 3500-7000 resources, and then a small little rock that is maybe 10 meters away that is itself one node, which is 3500 resources. Or decrease the amount of time it takes for the node to be full again.

Also some places it looks like there are not enough nodes as there should be.
 

oheyo

Junior Member
Supply and demand will eventually make it worth for people to switch professions to supply what you guys demand. However, for this to go quicker we all need to use the trade broker.
 

Incarnadine

Well-Known Member
To be honest I disagree...
Drac... how familiar are you actually with the crafting system? It's main problem is -not- the materials... It's how it is so incredibly limited despite that it's SUPPOSED to be so diverse... Billions of possibilities... a very small number of actually viable possibilities.

The pvp dilemma... The biggest problem is the skill gaps. The low skill time frame wouldn't be so hard or frustrating if you had the option to fight people at your current skill grade, instead a new player still skilling up ends up getting anal raped by some maxed skill troll who wants to boost his e-peen by killing a noob in rags or at best, bone armor. Or if hes REALLY enterprising and paying attention how to farm and saving, MAYBE... scale.
 

Bernajo

Exalted Member
To be honest I disagree...
Drac... how familiar are you actually with the crafting system? It's main problem is -not- the materials... It's how it is so incredibly limited despite that it's SUPPOSED to be so diverse... Billions of possibilities... a very small number of actually viable possibilities.

The pvp dilemma... The biggest problem is the skill gaps. The low skill time frame wouldn't be so hard or frustrating if you had the option to fight people at your current skill grade, instead a new player still skilling up ends up getting anal raped by some maxed skill troll who wants to boost his e-peen by killing a noob in rags or at best, bone armor. Or if hes REALLY enterprising and paying attention how to farm and saving, MAYBE... scale.
Agree with everything here. The boredom with crafting is due in part to the lack of viable crafting options. You are making making 5-8 weapons or armor types most of the time with no reward with finding new options. On top of that crafters are constantly killed or griefed by by asshats (who then make threads stating timers are the issue). MO has become a deathmatch for a lot of ppl and they simply don't want to play. I love pvp, but I understand that for a mmo to be successful, it needs to appeal to other types of players. In eve I knew ppl who loved to mine, folks who like to explore and find things, ppl who want to pve. MO does not reward these play styles, you can explore the furthest reaches, but you won't find anything more then a scenic view.
 

KhaoticKaos

Well-Known Member
Agreed that the extraction system is a little extreme, disagree that mo is a pvp game. Its an rpg, not call of duty
 

Incarnadine

Well-Known Member
As Berna and Kaos stated... MO essentially is call of mortal with lots of minigames... The crafting system appears to be on its way towards a re-haul so we will see how that turns out, the noobs ganked by douches problem... There really isnt alot to do bout that without being abuseable. Possibly keep a yellow flag on someone until they get their skills to a certain point, keep loot/money restrictions to limit their abuseability, and allow yellow flagged to attack eachother. Noobie pvp?
 

Henrik Nystrom

CEO
Staff member
The game was never intended for you to in 1 min get oghmium or kronite to get to pvp with best options.
Just like in eve online there are tiers on the materials, not everyone pvp with tier 2-3 items in eve nor do you in MO, its a question of if its worth it or not. It should be very risky and a huge risk/reward to bring in pvp when you have invested such time into getting oghm similar materials to the battlefield. The curve on materials goes pretty steady, which means you really dont need oghm to win all battles, player skills are most important. You can even win with normal steel if you know how to. So that statement may be your opinion and perhaps shared by some, but its never intended to be like that. Craft in a basic material and yo uget instantly pvp if thats what you are looking for. Or simply build a connection with some ppl that love to craft those high end materials and buy them directly from him. On combat beta we handed those materials because we needed to test them of course. but they are meant to be hard to get, and its about an option for the player, and they not decide the outcome of a battle, but they do give a bonus, just as intended.

Some systems may have changed over time during release however, such as butchery and some similar system, giving more "pauses" in money making or battles. Some may have made it harder to get in instant pvping for those who is interested in that. and some may have removed some hot spots for instant actions, that itself is something I miss as well to have as an option. we are looking into these areas to see what we can change and improve to help give players more options to get to the play style they like. But like someone else said here as well the game is not only a pvp game, its a first person mmorpg, where we want to tie all play styles together.

Thanks
 

Incarnadine

Well-Known Member
Henrik, on the note of areas for constant action...

What about decreasing carcass amount per drop and increasing the yield of carcass? So that you get as much, maybe evne a little more, gold/hr uninterrupted but in general you are out there hunting a bit longer, increasing people being out there meaning more possible pvp hotspots (Some mobs would need tweaked if this were to happen like Guars+ size wise since they typically drop enough on one kill for a full haul, may become easier to do 1 kill of those n back.

Just my two cents on that note.
 

Henrik Nystrom

CEO
Staff member
Henrik, on the note of areas for constant action...

What about decreasing carcass amount per drop and increasing the yield of carcass? So that you get as much, maybe evne a little more, gold/hr uninterrupted but in general you are out there hunting a bit longer, increasing people being out there meaning more possible pvp hotspots (Some mobs would need tweaked if this were to happen like Guars+ size wise since they typically drop enough on one kill for a full haul, may become easier to do 1 kill of those n back.

Just my two cents on that note.
Interesting.
 
The game was never intended for you to in 1 min get oghmium or kronite to get to pvp with best options.
Just like in eve online there are tiers on the materials, not everyone pvp with tier 2-3 items in eve nor do you in MO, its a question of if its worth it or not. It should be very risky and a huge risk/reward to bring in pvp when you have invested such time into getting oghm similar materials to the battlefield. The curve on materials goes pretty steady, which means you really dont need oghm to win all battles, player skills are most important. You can even win with normal steel if you know how to. So that statement may be your opinion and perhaps shared by some, but its never intended to be like that. Craft in a basic material and yo uget instantly pvp if thats what you are looking for. Or simply build a connection with some ppl that love to craft those high end materials and buy them directly from him. On combat beta we handed those materials because we needed to test them of course. but they are meant to be hard to get, and its about an option for the player, and they not decide the outcome of a battle, but they do give a bonus, just as intended.

Some systems may have changed over time during release however, such as butchery and some similar system, giving more "pauses" in money making or battles. Some may have made it harder to get in instant pvping for those who is interested in that. and some may have removed some hot spots for instant actions, that itself is something I miss as well to have as an option. we are looking into these areas to see what we can change and improve to help give players more options to get to the play style they like. But like someone else said here as well the game is not only a pvp game, its a first person mmorpg, where we want to tie all play styles together.

Thanks
Henrik, mind replying to these:

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/threads/games-current-population-state-tips-butchery.78846/

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/threads/suggestion-that-could-increase-population-activity.79163/
A lot of good suggestions there.
 

bjbarsted

Senior Member
This
Henrik, on the note of areas for constant action...

What about decreasing carcass amount per drop and increasing the yield of carcass? So that you get as much, maybe evne a little more, gold/hr uninterrupted but in general you are out there hunting a bit longer, increasing people being out there meaning more possible pvp hotspots (Some mobs would need tweaked if this were to happen like Guars+ size wise since they typically drop enough on one kill for a full haul, may become easier to do 1 kill of those n back.

Just my two cents on that note.

This is what myself and arfy have been saying since butchery was implemented
Before butchery you would spend 20 to 30 mins out hunting in the open and always watching your back for the red that is probably hiding in the bush it made it a lot more interesting and fun
Now you go out kill one mob and can't even carry all of the carcass some times and it takes 5 mins
 

Ichorous

The Argent Speedster
Henrik, on the note of areas for constant action...

What about decreasing carcass amount per drop and increasing the yield of carcass? So that you get as much, maybe evne a little more, gold/hr uninterrupted but in general you are out there hunting a bit longer, increasing people being out there meaning more possible pvp hotspots (Some mobs would need tweaked if this were to happen like Guars+ size wise since they typically drop enough on one kill for a full haul, may become easier to do 1 kill of those n back.

Just my two cents on that note.
Realism actually calls for more carcass to drop. A fully grown horse drops less than 20 kg of carcass. The amount of carcass dropped should be exactly equal to the mass of the living creature. Fully grown horses weigh a lot more than 20 kg.
 

Incarnadine

Well-Known Member
I did love the days of hunting on wisent hill watching over my shoulder for a red to run by... or having to eyeball that guy 20ft away who is looking at me thinking "Is the possible death or MC worth that wool he has on him..."
 

Incarnadine

Well-Known Member
Realism calls for permadeath. Want that too?

Yes, that is related. Without perma death, we aren't cautious about shit. The real life hunter going out for a haul will be alot more cautious if theres a chance of bandits/murderers in the area, which takes longer and less likely to get a full haul. Without perma death? "LEEEEEERROY. Oh good, I got carcass."
 

Ichorous

The Argent Speedster
Permadeath would significantly change the nature of this game. More carcass would not.
 
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